Conversation
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Glad to hear about a BLM activist call for community solutions as a replacement for policing
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@maiyannah you don't see that as a false dichotomy? Can't have grassroots militias for self defense?
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@maiyannah not sure, Africa's a big place. Most of what I find is South Africa. If you have a country/region in mind I could take a look.
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@taknamay Well, I mention it because the conflict between tribes we see now with African warlords initially involved the accumulation of security forces the UN even approved, because it _started_ as "hey we need to be able to defend ourselves", but what ultimately happened is that you had certain tribes and groups that had more money or resources and thus were better equipped, and used that better equipment to subjugate competing tribes around them. I agree that you should be able to defend yourself, but if we are to propose that kind of thing, we also need checks and balances to ensure it doesn't get used in that sort of way to bully communities around you, in my opinion. People are going to be people. Some people are good people. Some are ... not. One has to plan for those that don't have good intentions doing nasty stuff to others.
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@taknamay It becomes a problem when you are "defending yourself" by being aggressive to others, and while one might say that's obviously not self-defense and I'd agree, that doesn't address the problems that come with such an abuse.
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@maiyannah OK, I understand more now. Allied small communities can beat back a conqueror. I look at the Greco-Persian Wars for example.
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@taknamay @maiyannah Actually neighbohood watches are a great thing, but they can't be equipped above the police. Taking turns to have two neighbors per night making rounds like a private security firm would, armed with say, a 9mm gun? that would be nice, it's enough to stop robberies, rapes, and the like, but two guys with pistols can't fight a police strike team. Now, this only works in communities where it's people vs criminals, it doesn't work in places like the areas of USA where as mentioned the black population is openly hostile to the police. That'd only devolve in stockpiling of weapons and a civil, racial fueled war. If there's racial tension (specially to such an stupid degree, with endless scapegoating and blame throwing as an escape from actually solving anything and integrating populations) it won't be good. If the situation is simply a lack of security due to the police being understaffed, underequiped, or incompetent like where I live it's a great idea.
Wednesday, 20-Jul-16 21:28:21 UTC from web-
@nerthos @taknamay @maiyannah In fact I thought about establishing one of these in my neighborhood, but didn't after carefully thinking due to a lack of communication and trust between neighbors, since any of the people I don't know or new neighbors could have ties to crime and give patrol schedules to thieves, in the best case making the watch useless and in the worst getting them kiled.
Wednesday, 20-Jul-16 21:30:20 UTC from web -
@nerthos being in the US I see my guns as a way to protect my home and family when there isn't time to wait for the police. They're also useful if I'm hiking or w/e in bear country. Other than that or target practice they stay inside. @taknamay @maiyannah
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@fl0wn Yeah, of course. I'm pro-gun, always have been. I'm against feeding weapons in enough quantity and power to overpower the security forces to people who want a racial war tough. Guns are great if you'll use them for defending yourself and your home, but certain portions of the population are sadly too stupid and xenophobic to be allowed any.
Wednesday, 20-Jul-16 21:38:59 UTC from web -
@fl0wn Basically what I'm saying is "people should be allowed to have guns of their own, but the formation of racial militias should be prevented"
Wednesday, 20-Jul-16 21:41:12 UTC from web
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