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> Regarding the transman competing on the women's team
Wonder why they didn't let him compete with boys. At this point his body has transitioned and is a physical match for boys so why not let him go there?
Then again, I've never cared too much about the split between men and women's sports because I'd figure even if on average women aren't as physically strong as men, if there is a woman who is, might as well let her compete on someone her level, man or woman.-
@gameragodzilla Rogan commented on this, in some sorts the split makes little sense, in others it does. In MMA for example a transwoman is going to have a huge advantage over the average woman and I remember there being quite a scandal about one not being honest about being trans. Whatever you think about transitioning though, lying to the athletic association's doctors is a BAD BAD IDEA and you SHOULDNT DO IT. These are the people who might be saving your life if someone punches your ticket in the ring.
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@maiyannah Didn't this happen with an hermaphrodite in the olympics in the first half of the XX century, with their medals being removed after?
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:33:53 UTC from web-
@nerthos I vaguely remember like this. Dishonesty should never be rewarded, so I agree with the athletic association disqualifying the transwoman I mentioned.
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@nerthos I honestly don't give two papayas about it if they're up front about it. But being dishonest is bad and should be punished.
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@maiyannah IMO people that stray from the norm shouldn't be allowed into professional competitions with sex-based categories as they throw everything off. It's not nice but allowing otherwise makes the competition unfair.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:39:37 UTC from web-
@nerthos If they're honest to being what they are and the other fighter is willing to take them on, why not?
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@maiyannah In individual competitions that's fine, but in say, the olympics or whatever other huge event where you can't get the entire roster of competitors to agree on it it can't be done while mantaining fairness.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:43:07 UTC from web -
@maiyannah Because I mean, say you're a female boxing champion and accept fighting a transexual for the title. What happens if you lose, and the next contender for the title doesn't agree with that? They have a point in wanting the title to be held by an actual woman they can fight fairly and without biological advantages. This is why I say "professional competitions"
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:46:11 UTC from web-
@nerthos If they don't want to fight the champion, they can't become champion. Fluffle Puffing simple.
"But I don't wanna fight them!" Tough luck buttercup.-
@maiyannah If the champion has a biological advantage then the whole competition is desvirtuated. Much cleaner to keep the classical restrictions in place.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:51:56 UTC from web-
@nerthos If you can't hold the championship against all comers in your weight class, you don't mangoing deserve the championship.
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@nerthos I guess we can have a category for sisses who need their hand held by mommy though.
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@maiyannah Eh, I don't intend to convince you, just pointing out why allowing such things causes everything to devolve into arguments on the validity of this or that. The same that happened here would happen to the organizers and authorities of the competition.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:55:10 UTC from web-
@nerthos If you're not the best you don't deserve the championship, I don't really care about what your excuses are.
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@maiyannah If you're the best of your biological sex, I think you deserve the title for that category.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:57:46 UTC from web-
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@maiyannah I should remember that you're a jerk when it comes to this particular topic.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 14:59:24 UTC from web
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@nerthos @maiyannah Biological sex doesn't necessarily determine physicality. There's a trend, but there are definitely still women physically stronger than me for example, so I think competitions should be broken down via physicality alone rather than gender, and everyone gets placed in their "weight class" so to speak
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@gameragodzilla Still, I think all competitors should run on the same hardware so to speak for it to be fair.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 15:02:01 UTC from web-
@nerthos @gameragodzilla If you think that gives you an advantage, I invite you to spend five rounds in the ring if ever you're up heree.
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@maiyannah That would prove absolutely nothing, since I'm no athlete. If I had the same training then sure, but I don't.
Tuesday, 28-Feb-17 15:06:39 UTC from web
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@nerthos The only "hardware" that's relevant is your physical prowess, aka your muscles and flexibility. And while there are certainly trends for all of that stuff regarding gender, it's not an end all be all thing. If all women are uniformly weaker than all men, that would be a valid point, but that's not the case as with most things regarding individuals vs. individuals compared to overall trends.
In my eyes, if a man and a woman are both of the same physicality in weight, muscle mass or whatever, it's a fair competition.
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"Tough luck, Buttercup! You killed someone who had no business being in the ring because Polite Society is too scared to say, 'No!' Please enjoy the trauma of that death for the rest of your life!"
We can call this new "sensible, tough attitude" the Abusive Nanny State. That means I don't have to feel sad at all if someone's tossing dead trannies out of a ring like cordwood? Right? @maiyannah @nerthos
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@maiyannah Yeah I'm aware of that situation. So I wonder what exactly should be done about it? Because in that instance, a transwoman competed in women's sports and wiped the floor due to her physical advantage while here, a transman competed in women's sporte and also wiped the floor due to his physical advantage.
My idea was weight classes for all genders so even if it's not an even split between men and women in each physicality tier they may be on equal footing within said tiers but I don't know enough about biology or sexual dimorphism to know if that's viable or not-
@gameragodzilla Honestly I think it's best to leave it case to case to what the doctors thing isnt undue risk and the athletes are willing to fight, when it comes to MMA.
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@maiyannah True, especially since I don't think the trans community is so big that general measures should be taken. It's enough of a rarity in sports that a case by case basis is possible.
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@gameragodzilla Its less black and white in team competitions or competitions with several participants, but in 1v1 competitions like MMA the solution is pretty simple IMO.
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@maiyannah True but even then I think you could do case by case there and determine if certain team compositions are unfair or not
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@gameragodzilla You could if people wanted to, but most won't. They will seize any advantage to put themselves ahead or any means to disqualify an opponent for fear of losing.
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@maiyannah True but that level of dishonesty exists regardless of whether or not there's a trans competitor
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@gameragodzilla Yep. For all the talk of sportsmanship most professional sports are anything but.
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@maiyannah All competition has cheaters.
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