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  1. I have managed to get nibs spill less ink with wiping the excess against the bottle edge, but that doesn’t seem to be enough.

    Maybe those real girls doing penmanship use a brush to put ink on the nib are doing that not just because they are afraid of getting dirty with the ink.

    …or I may apply too much force trying to reach contrast of main and supplemental strokes. https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/282554

    I guess I will tag my posts with #, because I don’t use fountain pens.

    Saturday, 21-Jan-17 23:55:02 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
    1. Ha-ha. I was right.
      Look at the size of line at which they do copperplate and compare to spencerian. This proves that copperplate at line height of 5 mm is nearly impossible. Spencerian doesn’t use shades except for they come out naturally or making a shade is cherry easy and doesn’t strain hand. And shades on small letters of spencerian are barely noticeable in comparison to copperplate shades.

      # https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/283045 https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/283046

      Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:26:07 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
      1. @tijagi what a weird pen

        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:27:39 UTC from web
        1. @nerthos It’s actually good if you don’t want your letters look jugged like the Lord of the Rings logo. I want to make such pen holder.

          Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:35:43 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
          1. @tijagi I assume it'd take some time to get used to it.

            Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:35:56 UTC from web
            1. @nerthos I’d say no. It only allows you to hold the dip pen the way you hold a ball pen and lower the angle at which nib touches paper.
              Straight holder doesn’t use palm as a rest as much as a ball pen uses it. Higher angle increases chance that the nib will scratch the paper, and when you lower the holder, this hurts your wrist. That’s definitely not healthy, because I already got tremor in my right hand a month ago. Around that time my kettlebell once slipped from my wrist, leaving an unpleasant dent on wooden floor.

              Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:50:07 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
              1. @tijagi Good point. Then again I'm already used to holding pens at a sharp angle. Most of the time I use mechanical pencils because unlike ball pens they don't malfunction due to angle.

                Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:52:53 UTC from web
                1. @nerthos > I use mechanical pencils because unlike ball pens they don't malfunction due to angle
                  In my opinion they both cannot work at sharp angles. And while a ball pen would leave traces instead of lines, mechanical pencil would simply break the lead. https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/213408

                  Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:23:41 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                  1. @tijagi It only breaks the lead if you're using an extremely soft one or pushing it out a lot. If it has a thin tube and you're using hb or 2b, you can use it at 15º just fine.

                    Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:23:50 UTC from web
                    1. @nerthos Sorry for using Rotring Tikky 0.35.

                      Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:30:39 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                      1. @tijagi That one should be fine.

                        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:30:18 UTC from web
                      2. @tijagi I generally use one of these http://www.selplast.com.ar/fotosCatalogo/21732-0.jpg because I just got used to thin pencils.

                        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:34:27 UTC from web
                        1. @nerthos
                          > 0.5 mm pencil lead
                          > at 15°
                          > thin
                          https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/283465 https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/41031

                          Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:55:37 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                          1. @tijagi Fixed. Writing until the tip is at 15º beats the point of "using the edge of the lead" http://rainbowdash.net/attachment/856257

                            Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:57:32 UTC from web
                  2. @tijagi @nerthos well then you're probably pressing down too hard

                    Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:24:31 UTC from freezepeach.xyz
                    1. @hakui @nerthos Excuse me, I am trying to write here.

                      Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:26:59 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                      1. @nerthos @hakui Actually, I have noticed earlier, when I wrote that Haruhi text probe, that I sometimes break the lead at the normal angle where I would usually put pressure to make a shade.

                        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:28:17 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                        1. @tijagi Buy 4b or 6b leads instead and use less pressure.

                          Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:28:19 UTC from web
                          1. @nerthos But blackness (B) is reached with more softness of the lead, so it could leave more material on the writing surface. https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/182531

                            Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:44:56 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                            1. @tijagi Yes, and that also means you need to apply less pressure, being able to shade just as much without pressing the pencil hard enough that the lead will break. a 6 is soft enough that the line is black even if you're just brushing it against the paper.

                              Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:45:11 UTC from web
                              1. @nerthos Okay, I give up. You’re the wonner.

                                Sunday, 22-Jan-17 23:00:39 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                      2. @nerthos @hakui Also in my opinion ‘sharp’ is 10–15°.

                        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:28:47 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                        1. @tijagi @nerthos buying a protractor so i can measure my writing angle (`・ω・)7

                          Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:29:27 UTC from freezepeach.xyz
                          1. @hakui Just take a pic of your hand holding the pen with the phone or camera against the table and measure it digitally or by eye

                            Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:31:29 UTC from web
                            1. @nerthos @hakui > or by eye
                              https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/98890

                              Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:39:39 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                              1. @tijagi I'm an electro-mechanical technician, I'm supposed to be able to tell angles just by looking at them. Part of my job and all that.

                                Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:40:38 UTC from web
                                1. @nerthos I am glad for the future of whatever country do you live in.

                                  Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:58:58 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                                  1. @tijagi Sometimes you can be really deliberately dense

                                    Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:58:20 UTC from web
                                    1. @nerthos
                                      > first I say that I like to write with mechanical pencils, because they, you see, can write at sharp angles unlike ball pens. I like thin lines.
                                      > oh, sorry, I forgot to mention I actually use 0.5 mm leads.
                                      > oh, sorry, I don’t know which leads are harder, H or B.
                                      > oh, sorry, I actually do not use sharp angles this much.
                                      > oh, sorry, my leads are so strong they do not wear out.
                                      > you’re so dense, tijagi.
                                      Hai, gomen. https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/224812

                                      Sunday, 22-Jan-17 23:09:51 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                                      1. @tijagi Apparently you've managed to misinterpret or take each of my replies as an absolute. Let me go over it again to clarify:
                                        I like mechanical pencil over ball pen because they give me the option of using them at most angles depending on need since they use a solid lead instead of ink, and I can fix any mistakes. The option is the key part here, doesn't mean I'll use them like that all the time. Most of my writing is either on the computer or taking notes, traditional writing stuff I use for either drawing or fancy letters of which I'll never need to do many in one go.
                                        I use 0.5mm since 0.5 and 0.7 are the only cheap ones found everywhere and I don't need something else enough to invest on a set of expensive pencils.
                                        I know which is which, what I was going at is that by using softer leads you need less pressure to leave the same amount of lead on the page, so it's easier to avoid putting enough pressure on the tip that it'll break when you're doing shading or filling.

                                        Monday, 23-Jan-17 11:38:47 UTC from web
                                        1. @nerthos > Apparently you've managed to misinterpret or take each of my replies as an absolute
                                          Sorry for expecting people to speak correct, actual and unambiguous statements. https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/41768

                                          Monday, 23-Jan-17 13:05:05 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                                          1. @tijagi Hey, if we're supposed to speak with no ambiguity or any literary resources we might as well use lojban. It's not fun like that.

                                            Monday, 23-Jan-17 14:02:45 UTC from web
                                            1. @nerthos  https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/34193

                                              Monday, 23-Jan-17 14:36:08 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                                      2. @tijagi (cont) I use sharp angles now and then for detail work, it wouldn't make sense to do it all the time for drawing. Doesn't mean I don't appreciate having the option rather than having to switch back and forth between pencils
                                        Leads wear out, sure, but since I'll only be doing a few cm at most of angle details at a time, I can just turn the pencil around and use an edge that hasn't worn out yet.
                                        Hopefully this will clear out any confusions.

                                        Monday, 23-Jan-17 11:41:17 UTC from web
                                  2. @tijagi Since I have to explain it in detail apparently, what I meant is "I can tell if something's at a certain angle with a reasonable margin just by looking at it due to working with angles" not "lol I'll skip measuring implements when filing a tool"

                                    Sunday, 22-Jan-17 23:00:13 UTC from web
                              2. @tijagi @nerthos nasu has endowed upon me the Mystic Eyes of Radian Perception

                                Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:41:47 UTC from freezepeach.xyz
                          2. @hakui @nerthos I recommend buying metal one.
                            Metal one.
                            Metal one.
                            Met-met-met-metaaaaaaaaaあああああああああああああああ  https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/283442

                            Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:37:40 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                        2. @tijagi My usual drawing/writing angle is 25-30º and sharp is 15º

                          Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:29:27 UTC from web
                      3. @tijagi @nerthos yes would you care to explain what you meant by that https://freezepeach.xyz/attachment/25095

                        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:28:15 UTC from freezepeach.xyz
                        1. @hakui @nerthos Try to write a page at 10° with a mechanical pencil at your usual speed.

                          Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:33:39 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                          1. @tijagi Why would someone write an entire page at 10º

                            Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:33:50 UTC from web
                            1. @nerthos @tijagi I mean it makes sense with a caligraphy pen but no other writing device has any advantages at that angle.

                              Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:35:58 UTC from web
                            2. @nerthos That wasn’t me who said, that he likes to write with mechanical pencils, because they can do that at sharp angles unlike ball pens.

                              Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:47:43 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
                              1. @tijagi CAN, doesn't mean I'll do it all the time. It's for details that I go with sharp angles as it lets me draw with the edge of the lead so the line will be about a third or half as thick.

                                Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:47:59 UTC from web
                                1. @nerthos @tijagi For writing a full page I'll go with 30º or so.

                                  Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:49:39 UTC from web
                          2. @tijagi @nerthos sorry but i've just tested it out—for normal lengths of lead poking out the lowest you can go is 20°

                            if you can reach 10° obviously you had too much lead and it's going to break, silly

                            Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:38:54 UTC from freezepeach.xyz
                            1. @hakui You can push it to 15º writing with the edge but you have to constantly rotate and the line isn't even. I use that for very thin lines as I just use a 0.5mm one for everything.

                              Sunday, 22-Jan-17 22:41:42 UTC from web
                            2. @hakui @nerthos 
                              ― You are Misono Hakui? Here’s a letter for you.

                              ‘To my dear INTJ Hakui

                              I appreciate your approach, sorry for leaving you  in the company of lone tumbleweeds rolling across the road.

                              Sincerely yours,
                              Tijagi’

                              Sunday, 22-Jan-17 23:21:52 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
      2. And again – look at the copperplate sample size! https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/283048

        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:30:38 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
      3. And again – look at the copperplate sample size! https://gs.smuglo.li/attachment/283051

        Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:32:14 UTC from gs.smuglo.li
        1. By the courtesy of IAMPETH: https://gs.smuglo.li/url/283052

          Sunday, 22-Jan-17 13:32:54 UTC from gs.smuglo.li