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@snowcone You act as if there's any way to fight the universe. You gotta trust in a higher power to get anywhere pony.
Tuesday, 18-Feb-14 08:15:29 UTC from web-
@snowcone What is this?
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@snowcone Oh boy. I'm trying really hard not to read them, but the took the week off on the show so idk
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@snowcone Your deadpan lackluster responses are the best.
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@snowcone It's honestly why I like so many of your replies. It's my kind of humor.
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@snowcone Not a lot enough people appreciate dry humor.
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@snowcone I used to attract the weird ones until I got older and more crotchety and began to scare them away.
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@snowcone Wow, that's so true. I know exactly what you mean. It actually tends to happen a lot on this site, but it seems to happen to me everywhere else as well. I'm not really sure why? I try to be light hearted about everything, although I did post a sad sob story post about my cat, but yah I never know what I'm supposed to do in those situations...
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@snowcone You may have better luck at Yiffcone.
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@snowcone Then I meant Yiffcon.
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@snowcone People have a wider variety of world views and moral stances at those things than they do if you commit to a wholesome religious organization of some kind.
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@snowcone Plus, with a faith-oriented approach you get to see the same group of people weekly at least. (If it's a singles congregation then even more frequently.)
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@snowcone We seem to have similar history's on this site. But I've tried the whole look uninterested all the time thing, and it tends to work in real life, and the green hair may also improve results. The problem, though, is on the internet no one knows that you look bored/annoyed and completely uninterested in what they're saying. That's why dry responses come into play, which you seem to have a pretty good grasp on.
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@snowcone I never said you did.
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@snowcone yah
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@snowcone pudding chest. I want to call a lady at work that.
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@snowcone Emotional trainwrecks are exactly the type of person who will be likely to have a second date that involves moving your stuff into their spare room
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@snowcone delivery
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@snowcone But banana is obviously the asian one.
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@snowcone You may want to work on it.
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@theyurityphoon I would've gone with rice pudding.
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@snowcone I am, everyday.
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@extremedash Mainly by talking to you...
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@snowcone The ones I know do.
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@snowcone You may want to get her some help. Or not, she could really cool when she's drunk. I don't know.
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@snowcone Damn. What is this? An episode of "Yo Momma"?
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@snowcone You act as if we're anything but insignificant specks of no consequence in the vastness of space.
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@snowcone I used to watch MTV.
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@pony You've clearly never watched Gurren Lagann.
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@pony But there is and you don't, really.
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@extremedash I have not, but I have watched DBZ and Doctor Who so I have an idea of what delusions go through people's heads.
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@pony Great response.
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@snowcone Oh, I've never watched MTV 2, but if it plays Family Guy then there's no way I'll ever start.
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@theyurityphoon Brevity sometimes works well. :)
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@pony Gurren Lagann has grander delusions than both of those shows.
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@extremedash Oh! Now I'm interested.
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@snowcone I might. It doesn't get much use now anyways.
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@pony It was more sarcasm since you didn't really prove a point or try to give a reason for anything. You just falt out refused something I said.
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@pony You act as if we aren't?
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@pony The show's theme is "If there's a greater power, kill it."
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@theyurityphoon I'm aware. I rarely miss sarcasm. Sometimes it happens though. Thanks for confirming anyway.
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@snowcone Yah.
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@extremedash Sounds like Nerthos's plan.
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@pony Glad to see that you're still not proving me wrong. Individuality and willpower will always outperform people sitting there talking to a statue or what have you.
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@snowcone It's pretty good. Definitely not boring.
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@extremedash Kill la Kill also has that kind of theme.
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@pony It's too inspiring for that.
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@snowcone Gurren Lagann and Kill la Kill are both really action-oriented shows. Really good. 11/10.
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@theyurityphoon Yah very true. Also by the same creators as GL. Loving the avatar btw.
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@snowcone You mean to tell me that it wasn't before?
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@extremedash I am too. Took a lot of cropping to be SFW though. *wink*
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@ceruleanspark You ask the best questions. We're insignificant without a higher power that cares about us. I suppose that's pretty obvious, but I'm surprised by what people believe all the time.
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@snowcone Still somewhat-religion-related, I guess.
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@theyurityphoon I think you have the wrong idea about what I believe, but your tone implies you'd rather not hear it, and, beside, any time I go into what i know it just causes drama. I've decided that RDN generally isn't receptive, so I avoid answering arguments unless there's somepony who shows genuine interest.
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@pony The universe is, regardless of your belief, provably vast, and in all probability, teeming with life:Why would any given entity care about us specifically?
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@theyurityphoon Who's the artist? I feel like I might know who it is...
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@snowcone Did you mean "insignificant?" Also, I don't know the expression "turtles all the way down."
I'd love to answer what I think you've asked, maybe via DM? -
@snowcone The man is Atlas.
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@snowcone He is a Titan in Greek mythology.
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@ceruleanspark Because of our potential I think, and because it guided our creation from the rudimentary states in which we originally existed.
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@pony So what about everyone else? Do they /not/ matter? Do they lack the "Mandate of heaven" or whatever it's actually called?
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@snowcone Yep that is correct. Although after the defeat of the Titans he was punished and forced to hold up Uranus instead of being killed.
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@snowcone Ah cool! Well then good guess. To put it simply, without DMing, I'll just answer by saying, yes, partly. It's a combination of turtles and the fact that we are cared for by higher powers and not simply a single power. In other words, I think (not sure though) that they have power because they give it to each other and wish to give it to us.
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@ceruleanspark They (assuming you mean non-humans) also have potential, though it's a different kind of potential.
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@pony I mean sentient nonhuman civilisations, yes. Do they go to heaven, is the question I'm basically asking here
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@pony I talk about religion when I have questions or something catches my interest. I have no desire to get into the usual GOD DOESNT REAL FEDORA FEDORA DAWKINS BS that typically passes for religious discussion.
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@snowcone Atlas didn't actually "hold up" the Earth he embraced it. Thus making his punishment much worse than death because their "primordial embrace" would never be again. Or something like that.
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@snowcone My evidence is personally gained and unempirical but as real to me as the food I eat or the air I breath, and anybody can receive the same witness I have through their own personal devoted study and effort. So, to answer your question, no, I may not have the evidence you want, but the evidence exists and is observable by every one.
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@ceruleanspark They go to places designated for them according to their own spiritual laws determined by the same creator. Cool thing I heard is animals will have the ability to speak.
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@snowcone Well he is the Titan of Astronomy and Navigation, but other than that yah you're pretty much right. But pretty much everyone in Greek or Roman mythology is really rapey so it's not too weird.
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@ceruleanspark And I'm always appreciative of that.
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@pony So you're saying the creator entity presented itself to all sentient species and gave them different rules, and a different heaven/hell (as applicable) for each of them? That's an elegant way to handle it.
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@snowcone I extrapolate on what I know, but what I know is at the core of my religion's doctrines and not a unique knowledge set.
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@snowcone Well I meant to act as if Oedipus was the norm, because it was in Greek mythology.
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@ceruleanspark Essentially, yes. Though all rules for matter and entity alike, as far as I can tell, probably unite under more universal laws.
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@snowcone Yes, though I try as much as possible to stick to the principles and not interpret too much.
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@pony funny thing about evidence... There's only one meaning for it. It's not a homonym or anything, so it's fallacious to support a claim and/or counter a rebuttal by contorting scientific definitions. I'm just putting this out there, not sure who's saying what really but as soon as I see a word's definition in potential danger I jump in and preserve the intellectual integrity of the discussion.
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@snowcone No to the first and yes to the second question. Polytheism implies we worship more than one god.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline Ahem, 2 words: Pretentious. Diction. But I agree with what you're saying.
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@snowcone The man with the boulder is Sisyphus, and he was punished for tricking people. The other man is Prometheus, or the champion of humankind, and he was responsible for giving fire to man and causing the progression of our civilizations. He was punished by being pinned to boulder for eternity, and everyday an eagle would come by and eat his liver, which would then grow back and be eaten again the next day.
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@hoit not sure how I'm being pretentious. I just said I wasn't sure who's trying to twist definitions but someone could be, and that I will put forth a reminder when I notice someone could potentially be arguing by twisting words' meanings. Because doing that is a form of intellectual dishonesty.
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@pony You do realize that arguing your religion on here is like fighting a war with a squirt gun right? All these kiddos would rather squash what you have to say cause they're so enlightened and above you. You'll never actually have a good conversation about religion here bud.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline Arguing definitions is one of the most common ways I've seen to derail a conversation. It's an annoyance, but the fact remains that sometimes our language is ambiguous. @oracle isn't interested in discussing his parents' beliefs though, so I'm unlikely to try and resolve this point.
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@hoit Says the guy deliberately using condescending phrasing to put himself above others.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline No, no, no. You're not being pretentious not purposely anyway. You're just using big words when simple small ones convey what you're saying much easier. Its a thing most people do now a-days. But a good way to spot it is if you look and say: "What can I remove from here and not harm the sentence" Most of the time you'll find big words like "intellectual" and, "Integrity" can be replaced quite easily. But you don't have to listen.
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@ceruleanspark But I'm better than you? Aren't I?
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@hoit This is what RDN actually believes
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@ceruleanspark Glad to be a part of the movement!
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@snowcone I don't remember him having a wife, but his tale actually varies quite a bit throughout history. And as for Sisyphus, the boulder would just roll back down on it's own as he watched. He would then go and push it up the hill again. This was his eternal punishment.
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@hoit don't speak on my behalf. I'm willing to have an intelligent conversation with anyone about their religious beliefs, assuming that person is capable of defending their beliefs in an intelligent manner. Too often people get butthurt over plain and simple things like evidence, or they completely ignore the other person and just assume that their religious claim is impervious to intellectual scrutiny
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@snowcone In response to a conversation in which every participant was claiming to be above average
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@oracle You might be interested in the origins of the word "testimony," I mean beyond the fact that Romans used to swear by their murdocks.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline I'm gonna level with you here. Cause you I can tell you're pretty smart. I don't care. I honestly 100% don't give a toss about religion or anything anyone has to say about it. Frankly, I don't care if a christian thinks that god will save them or that I'm going to hell for who I choose to love. Doesn't bother me. I also don't care about people who hate religion. Go for it, hate the dole out of god or whatever. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter and isn't worth the time to be upset/intrigued about.
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@oracle Grrr I do not belif in ur god! Doughnut talk about him around me, it opresses mee grumble grumble
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@hoit I see now. No offense, but this is my vocabulary level in real life. I don't always "use big words" as the common phrase goes, but when I do, it's to convey that I'm not another kid who thinks the internet is a soapbox for them to blast idiotic ramblings. I care about what I say, and I care what words mean when people use them. It's not my fault if other people don't care, or are put off bywords with more letters in them.
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@snowcone Loki is from Norse mythology, but yes he's a god. As for Sisyphus he did not steal Zeus' lightning but he did trick Thanatos into chaining himself into Tartarus making it so no human could die.
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@snowcone Who says I need a reason? I'm not the one claiming a moral high ground over "not being condescending".
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline I suggest you read some Gorge Orwell. He addresses that thinking. It is, by all means, a good argument, but there is a point where they are more unneeded than otherwise. But I see your stand point.
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@hoit I enjoy your forthrightness, however I could argue that religion can be dangerous since beliefs inform actions. Also, religion is often turned into a political agenda. So, I'm curious to discover how many more deaths and wars it'll take before we realize a general clinging to superstitions is primarily responsible for our culture's immaturity
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@oracle I'm guess they'd have a chuckle with me, but just in case I should pray for 24 hours straight.
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@snowcone How should I know? I don't smoke, don't care to either. But if you'd like to, knock yourself out.
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@snowcone He actually started it by promoting commerce then proceeding to kill the traders to take their things. When Zeus tried to kill him he went and told Zeus' secrets to his enemies just to spite him, well and to get an eternal spring of water. He was only taken down after Ares got murdocked that no one was dying from his wars.
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@snowcone because slapping humility into a group of people who are being almost cartoonishly arrogant about their own percieved genius is worth doing from time to time.
Scribus likes this. -
@snowcone Always happy to answer questions. If you feel something is too drama-inducing to ask here you can always DM me or go on that other network.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline Like I said before. In one ear, right out the other. I have heard this stuff spewed at me from every angle and every side. And yet, still I don't care. Cause in the end, you won't kill religion. And it isn't gonna kill you (for the most part.) So why through rocks at a tank? Just walk away, let it run out of gas on its own. And besides for all the people religion kills I hear it saves just as many. If ya focus on the bad in the world, you'll never leave home, kemosabe!
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@snowcone I'll make it for you if you want. I've run into a small glitch with mine in Firefox though.. it makes the timeline jump constantly. Maybe I should bug @redenchilada and see if he'd be willing to help.
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@ceruleanspark Careful when you step down from that high horse! I almost broke a leg!
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@hoit Why would I ever get off of Trixie?
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@ceruleanspark Well I guess I've never seen you get off of it before so maybe you never will? Who knows!
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@hoit I intend to merge with her and become the direct incarnation of a high horse
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@snowcone What I did was find an existing Greasemonkey filter and modify it. Then Red helped by giving me the code to have it auto-update. It's nowhere near as complicated as Welcomepony.
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@ceruleanspark I've only ever seen that done once. It was a traumatic experience, you might not ever be the same.
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@hoit I don't intend to be the same. I will be...improved.
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@ceruleanspark Dare I say, enlightened...
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@hoit the issue of religion's contribution to civil inequalities and political tensions, as well as its other positive contributions, is too exhaustive to maintain a focused discussion or even to remain brief, as it requires both sides to be very informed both currently and historically. I do caution you to tread lightly with your lackadaisacal attitude towards the subject, as there is a century's worth of testimonies and evidence that indicate NOMA policies and their equivalents are more harmful to society than beneficial.
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@hoit l appreciate our talk and it seems I need to research george Orwell, lol
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline Yeah, I think you should.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline @hoit My easy way of summing it all up is that everything is a type of religion, including anti-religion.
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@hoit I do have to ask though, what was his argument? Because your previous phrasing conceerning this suggested that my position was uninformed, though you never directly addressed what this implied fallacy was
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@pony would you consider *not* playing sports, a sport? Or *no* collecting stamps, a hobby? See what I'm getting at here? Having no religion, is not a religion. Many people have trie to frame atheism as a religion to make it easier to criticize or attack, but it requires a perversion of several definitions in order to do so. (Like the meaning of religion)
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@pony Framing a lack of beliefs as a rigid dogma demands a level of hyperbole that becomes quite obvious once the claim is made.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline I think "lack of beliefs" is, in reality, a sign of a belief system that devalues rigid dogma (and itself may hypocritically be quite rigid in it's anti-rigidity sometimes).
You're right that in my simple statement I twist the definition of "religion" but I do it with a purpose. I'm saying that all belief systems, whether religious or not, share many things in common with one another. The notion may antagonize those who keep to a strict definition of religion, but my intention is to promote understanding and seek common ground. -
@pony 1. Look up "religion." 2. Look up "dogma." Do not call someone, or a group of people, something that they're not. Making up stuff, for example by saying my lack of religion is religion, will not give you the common ground you want. Speaking from an uninformed position will never give you common ground. You want common ground? Become a skeptic. Or just be skeptical for once. Question the validity of claims. Here's an easy one: if everyone claims their religion is right, doesn't it seem odd that a reported 90-some percent of religious people have the same belief system as their parents? Isn't that strange? You don't see that kind of indoctrination in the world of finding natural explanations for the world around us. Once you start asking questions, and abandon the comfort of complacent belief, you'll find common ground.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline Despite the aversion many have to being considered religious, I'll probably keep saying everything is a /type/ of religion. In the case that it doesn't help (even after I explain I don't mean it in the sense that everything is like an organized religion), at least I'll know who's open-minded enough to discuss things without getting too bogged down by their own definitions and beliefs, and I'll know to avoid talking to them about certain things or in a certain way. I'm not out to make people believe what I believe by my own merits. I care enough about people to hope they'll lend an ear sometimes, though, since I believe they can benefit from, if nothing else, a broadened understanding of someone else's beliefs. I'm a convert myself, so I greatly value the spreading of knowledge, whether of my own beliefs or of others that I feel can uplift, edify, and inspire people.
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@pony I have an "aversion" to religion the same way you might have an aversion to being called a "murderer" - as far as I know it isn't true so no one has any business calling you a murderer or saying my lack of beliefs is a belief. Don't accuse me or anyone else of being close-minded until you yourself start acknowledging even a single word I say, instead of deflecting it or dismissing it altogether. I have been very patient, but you are constantly arguing against a position I do not have - this is called "strawman" argument. The idea is, if you can get away with calling my lack of belief a belief, you can lump me into your anecdotal, unsupported viewpoints on belief. I made a direct statement that our difference in position is that I am skeptical, where you have made yourself plain in meaning that your beliefs validate your comfort or experiences. You then try to say everyone does with belief that you do, which is obviously not true.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline If you mean to redefine and use "murderer" in a way that accurately describes me, then I have no qualms with that, but I'm fairly open that way. I get that there have to be clear, generally accepted definitions in order for communication to go on effectively, but sometimes there's value in redefining things.
I made no accusation against you. I called those who cling to definitions "close-minded," and you applied it to yourself and went on to assume that "close-minded" is an accusation. It's simply a description. I recommend being open-minded, certainly, but that's up to you.
On the contrary, my beliefs constantly stir me to try and be better. They do give me comfort, but they also bring me quite of bit of fear for my behavior whenever I become complacent. Unless you want to disagree without being disagreeably presumptuous, I'd rather not discuss this any more. -
@pony so if I understand correctly, you're setting terms for the continued discussion that I agree to any and all meanings of words you wish to change, and that my adherence to the standard of conventional language will not be given any respect in this regard? It is unfair that you do not wish to continue the discussion because your personal interpretations of words aren't given the same credence as culturally-accepted meanings? You expect me, without any quid-pro-quo or exchange, to reconstruct my entire platform to fit how you alone, out of millions of people, use specific words? (Or am I given an arbitrary number of words to redefine, in order to keep the discussion fair?) Mind you, a discussion that defaults does not prove or refute either position's claims
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline I don't mind continuing the discussion. My only condition is that you ask my beliefs rather than tell them to me.
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@prettypurpleprincesspublicprincesstimeline on second thought nevermind. I don't want to waste the effort.
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@extremedash The artist's name is Wolfy-nail, and the character's name is Icee apparently.
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@theyurityphoon Yep I knew it. Kind of ashmed I did, but he's also one of biggest furry artists out there.
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