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There was zero point to that cutscene, what was the point of that cutscene
Monday, 09-Nov-15 00:56:52 UTC from web-
@mrmattimation From your description, fanservice.
I hope.Monday, 09-Nov-15 00:59:13 UTC from web-
@bobo >TFW that scene shows Quiet is actually a man
Monday, 09-Nov-15 00:59:44 UTC from web -
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@northernnarwhal >AKA literally Quiet
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:09:58 UTC from web-
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@northernnarwhal nerds she isn't even an anime character garbage waifu
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:15:53 UTC from web-
@bobo it would be nice if Kojima quit dancing around it and just openly admitted that Quiet's design is in fact just for the purpose of objectification, because it's no secret to anyone actually playing the game
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@northernnarwhal no you guys it's totally okay that she's objectified because she's OP no seriously you guys kappa
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:20:48 UTC from web -
@northernnarwhal Isn't big boss too, though? I know girls who consider him to be 100% rough honcho eyecandy
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:22:57 UTC from web-
@skellythos I mean, both are really attractive characters, sure. It's just a matter of design choices in terms of attire. Exhibit A: http://goo.gl/DCnWjA Exhibit B: http://goo.gl/IOGNr7
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:29:14 UTC from web-
@northernnarwhal Honestly, I think people are a bit too conscious about sexy clothing in videogames for adults nowadays. In the 90s you had characters fully nude and no one said anything. In Dagerfall you'd walk into any temple of Dibella and bam, boobs everywhere.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:36:26 UTC from web-
@skellythos I feel that both the audience for video games as well as the social criticism of them has progressed greatly since the 90s, so the paradigm of design ideals has changed since then too. I mean, I don't believe we should prudishly dress all our characters, and I'm not saying sexually provocative designs don't have their place. I just think we should be more conscious of the gender politics behind specific design choices as well as not make excuses for certain design choices that are blatantly sexist.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:42:19 UTC from web-
@northernnarwhal I've always been of the train of thought of "there are thousands of games, if a particular game goes against your morals, just don't play it" While I agree that designs must be reasonable, with things like bikini mails being plain stupid, I consider any designer should be free to put whatever they want in a game as long as they can justify it. In Quiet's case they've done so. I wouldn't say that "audience and criticism has progressed" as it hasn't made games better at all, it has just made developers wary of adding things because people would be upset about it, even when their games are rated +18. San andreas comes to mind, with hot coffee being cut off so no one would be offended; and so comes a quote by M'aiq the Liar: "I like children, we all do, but we don't want them ruining our fun" Games should have the same artistic liberties that books or music have. No one complains of the outright pornographic lyrics of many songs, so harmless sexism should be overlooked too
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:50:56 UTC from web-
@skellythos The thing about the whole "goes against your morals" principle is that I'm not saying "Quiet's design makes all of MGSV wrong" I'm just saying "I disagree with this specific design choice of MGSV". Because games, like any media really, are more complex than that. There are bound to be groups of things we agree or disagree with, things that do or don't work with us. It'd be plain silly if I never played a game like 999 simply because of a character like Lotus's design http://www.creativeuncut.com/gallery-21/art/999-lotus-concept.jpg because I love 999 and think it's an absolutely fantastic game. I just think it's important to acknowledge these kinds of things in our games and media, because they're reflective of larger underlying cultural conversations that are important to have.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:58:57 UTC from web-
@northernnarwhal Eh, while I believe we both have our good points, I don't think some fanservice is a big, bad enough issue that should be specifically acknowledged by the developers. I literally can't see how Quiet's design can cause any harm whatsoever to anyone.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:04:36 UTC from web-
@skellythos Well, Aye. I guess I can try to say it ruins immersion.
I don;t know. Playing devils advocate with that as it spawned in my head.Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:05:21 UTC from web -
@skellythos My view is more "this won't inflict any direct harm but is reflective or wider issues that will" though I understand your view on this
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:07:10 UTC from web-
@northernnarwhal I can't see how men wanting to add a girl with a revealing outfit to a game with a story of characters with outfits bordering on ridiculously cliched is an issue. Madnar was an einstein clone, Campbell was just a recolour of Rambo's colonel, young Ocelot is a military poster boy, Otacon is almost a joke, and just look at any of the MGS1 bosses. Metal Gear has always had ridiculous, absolutely impractical outfits for both male and female characters, and it's unfair to point out Quiet for this.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:19:13 UTC from web-
@skellythos It's because one is sexist and the others aren't, but that's just my perspective on it
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:20:38 UTC from web-
@northernnarwhal And I disagree not because I deny that Quiet's design is pure fanservice, but because there have been a great number of very sexist characters of both genders throughout the series.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:24:59 UTC from web-
@skellythos Fair enough
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:25:29 UTC from web
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@skellythos At the very least now they bother giving any srt of explanation for it.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:20:44 UTC from web
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@northernnarwhal Harmful sexism, like games encouraging and supporting making a gender to be inferior, be it stuff like classical "women should quietly obey their husbands" or "men shouldn't show any weakness and be the main source of income for the family" should be frowned at, as it can potentially influence players to be worse people, but a 20something running around in a bra and stockings isn't harmful to anyone.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:54:38 UTC from web-
@skellythos I feel like "harmful" is a spectrum and not really a binary, a piece of media can still contain harmful sexism without being something like blatantly supporting domestic abuse or something along those lines.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 02:02:02 UTC from web
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@northernnarwhal I'm pretty sure Kojima straight-up came out and said "yeah I wanted the design to be really sexy"
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:24:13 UTC from web-
@mrmattimation The game's writing kind of says otherwise and makes weird backwards attempts to justify her design choices
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:30:26 UTC from web-
@northernnarwhal I heard she breathes through her skin?
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:31:04 UTC from web-
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:32:10 UTC from web
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@scribus This is indeed the plot-point. Getting wet is totally fine tho *insert joke here ha ha ha*
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:32:19 UTC from web-
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:32:42 UTC from web
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Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:35:35 UTC from web
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@scribus yeah I actually just found out the full reason why she breathes exclusively through skin. Spoilers:
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:33:51 UTC from web-
@mrmattimation That's kinda the thing about Quiet in terms of character design though- sexist character design (and sexism in general) is nothing new to the games industry, what's funny is how far Kojima is stretching his writing to try and justify having that design in the game. It's like he's constantly shouting "No, really, it's not just sexually provocative, there's a reason in the story! Look, I wrote so myself!" but it's really unconvincing.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:38:03 UTC from web
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@bobo It's ok to like her because she's photorrealistic 3D with jiggle physics.
Monday, 09-Nov-15 01:18:20 UTC from web
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