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@comradeconventrix Good idea. There's no sense in arguing if there's no chance of changing the opposing party's mind anyway.
Friday, 18-May-12 00:44:30 UTC from web-
hello everypony ^_^
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@meshoealstar Nice avatar!
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@greydragon412 thank you im good how bout yourself?
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@ral thank you o.o .... *looks at yours* sooo colorful o.o what to poke it
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@meshoealstar Yes, Cteno is very colourful. I like yours more though, it reminds me of the good old Generations of My Little Pony. http://ur1.ca/99dxf
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@greydragon412 well i was looking around for a pony meet thing cause i dont go out much (not much friends to hang out with) and i dont know many irl fans i would love to meet some
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@comradeconventrix hiya ^_^ ... and i do believe its everywhere o.o the earth is to round to have a up
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@comradeconventrix oh im sorry i thought it was funny
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@comradeconventrix o.o" *hugs* atlest you still have some humor ^_^ i can get it
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@carcino i hope you get big hugs and even wider smiles today
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@meshoealstar Carcino never gets those.
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@ral ^_^ i realized but dosent hurt to hope it
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@meshoealstar That's horrible.
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@carcino aw but everyone needs hugs even little tiny ones ... and im sure you smile sometimes if not your frown would be freeze there forever and ever and you mouth muscle would hurt a LOT
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@meshoealstar My mouth muscles are perfectly fine where they are.
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@carcino sok then just have a fun life
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@meshoealstar Define fun.
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@carcino well theres different types of fun theres hoppy fun there giggle fun and my favorite twisted fun ^_^
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@meshoealstar None of those sound appealing in the least.
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@meshoealstar Your name reminds me of Zoamelgustar.
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@carcino hoppy is active outside stuff, giggle is laugh till you die from loss of air, and ^_^ twisted is that you joke about dark humor stuff, but then theres the wild card i dont know what its something about normal crap
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@nerthos whos that o.o he sounds fun
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@meshoealstar Again, none of that sounds appealing.
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@meshoealstar A fictional god from Slayers Next.
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@carcino just do what you enjoy to do then silly should make you somewhat smile inside
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@meshoealstar Smiling sounds horrible.
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@nerthos o.o huh i watched that but never payed attention to names cause who would care after lina destroy them XD
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@carcino smiling is wonderful! http://ur1.ca/99ee6
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@meshoealstar But it was the comic relief of the season! Martina and Zoamelgustar.
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@carcino i know but its going to had to you someday it may hurt .... a lot but you know youll look a lot cuter
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@praxiscalibrator No it's not. http://ur1.ca/99eed
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@meshoealstar You're fighting a losing battle you know. Carcino is just... Terrible.
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@meshoealstar I'm getting that everywhere, it's a pain.
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@ral who says im fighting im just being friendly by talking
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@nerthos v.v i know i know i fail
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@meshoealstar Talking to Carcino is not a good idea.
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@carcino COM3 ON, K4RKL3S. G1V3 US 4 SM1L3 http://ur1.ca/99ef2
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@ral Nonsense. He's the best bard.
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@praxiscalibrator Nice broken link.
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@ral He ain't so bad.
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@carcino ooooh nuuuuuuu! my point is lost without the picture!
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@scribus He's... Carcino. No need to say more.
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@carcino no pain no gain if you dont want the pain you wont gain a thing .... i like you ^_^ your funny
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@praxiscalibrator Too bad.
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@meshoealstar You're*
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@ral why you say that he aint that bad is he
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@ral You trying to start something again?
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@meshoealstar He's a troll. I just don't like trolls. Simple as that. I'll tolerate them, sure, but I don't like them.
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@carcino No, father. I'm not trying to start anything, father.
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@ral Shut up.
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@carcino But why, father?
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@ral i know his a troll i know hes trying really hard to push me off im fine with that i accept and the reason hes so funny is that he is trying so hard to be a big troll i find that interesting and just silly he dosent have to be a happy person to be liked nor dose he have to be liked at all i tolerate most people and i do care for them even if i dont like them
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@meshoealstar I for one can't stand Carcy. First because I really really really don't like Homestuck, And second because... well, I just don't like him. Underage drinking, etc.
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@ral But he's 18.
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@nerthos In America, it's not legal to drink until you're 21, at least, that's what I've been told.
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@ral then dont worry about him people are people as different as people can be we all live in this world to be our own selves ... i may not know much about homestuck but i do see bunch of pictures that i enjoy looking at ... and ral he made choices to be his own choices not yours his some can move pass it a actually be great friends they just have to choose to move pass the deeds
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@ral Then it's obvious there'll be lots of underage drinking. Badly planned government psychological control.
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@meshoealstar It's just, you know, I don't feel right around him. It's hard to explain.
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@nerthos The American government is stupid. We should all be communists.
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@ral I'm the most elitist guy you'll ever know outside organizations like the KKK. For me the best government is a theocratic monarchy.
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@nerthos Communism is pretty awesome too.
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@ral But only for a hive mind society, or at least with similar capabilities. On our species right now, it can't work. The IQ difference between the most dumb and the most bright should be of 50% for it to work.
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@nerthos No, I was talking RDN. RDN would be a good communist society.
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@ral Oh, yeah, that's true. Though we need appointed vigilantes.
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@comradeconventrix You understand nothing.
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@nerthos I appoint myself as a vigilante.
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@ral I apoint myself as the allmightiest holy high inquisitor.
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@nerthos Nuthing I didnt understand what your posting >...>
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@ral no i get it really theres people out there for me too but ignore it sometimes ... cause it hurts to much to know i let someone down by not trying my hardest to be friendly ... i may not be all that religious i say and do things im not suppose to but there are so many church people that is so mean and rude thats the people i cant ever like so the solution is to become the best as you can be ... my real religion is MLP cause i know by everywhere i went that we all are amazing and kind to everyone we meet thats why i want to spread the care
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@meshoealstar Wow, I've never thought of it that way. Thank you for the insight.
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@comradeconventrix Yes, by reaching godhood. But it's aganist all you believe in.
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@comradeconventrix That's no true unity. It's just a construct held together by laws.
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@comradeconventrix The nature of ours species can't allow us to become true communists.
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@comradeconventrix Think whatever you like. You're not a psychologist, social engineer, or philosopher.
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@nerthos We don't really knnow much about our species that is not socially constructed. We live in a society based on competition and internal struggle - this is what it is founded on and the meritocrat elements which form our culture do seem natural because this culture forged us to what we are today. This does not mean that those elements are human nature.
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@hakupony A communist system works at little scale. A town can be communist. A country can't.
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@thatonepony I agree it is a false meritocraty because it is not merits that are rewarded but to manipulate the system for your benefit.
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@hakupony Being able to bend the system for your benefit is the merit.
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@nerthos Not in the idea of meritocracy - the idea is that people who contribute much to society get much for it - so you train people to do much for society. This kind of meritocracy is one of the ideological structures which legitimate social differences. The funny thing is that it occupies our thinking in a way that most people would not work decently if they wouldn't get paid for it.
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@hakupony In fact, by contributing greatly you are recognized, and then you can choose to use that influence to gain political power. But whatever xD
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@nerthos That is the exact idea. The Problem is that you gain money (which is nothing as countable power) by abusing the system. The accumulation of capital and 90% of what happens atthe stock markets are things that give you power without requiring you to contribute anything. This is one of the two things Marx criticised on Capitalism.
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@hakupony Yes. But I like it because it's basically "Work a bit, then be wise with your money and it'll multiply without effort"
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@nerthos Or to put it in my rhetorics: "Work a bit to gain power, abuse that power and gget more power without actually doing anything for it." It's all a question of your point of view.
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@hakupony Yeah, pretty much.
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@comradeconventrix That's a really bad example. It's proven that a few will try to actually get a good grade, and the rest simply won't care, will try to leech the ones who are superior to them and want to work, and will end up complaining about how everyone failed. The worst thing is not that those idiots fail. Is that they harm those who are better than them by acting like that. They don't know their place.
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@comradeconventrix And the result is a mass of gorillas threatening and extorting them.
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@comradeconventrix You just provided a good example what social elements a communist society would have to overcome. Grades are nothing but an attempt to measure intellectual performance and commmunicate it in a way which legitimates social differences. Bad grades are a tool of education because they persuade the students that they have disadvantages becaue of their own fault.
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@comradeconventrix The "nerd give me your test" phenomenom is a good example of what I'm talking about. The brutes are many, so they have the advantage in a field without regulation. There's when people like me are needed, who step up when the brutes are harrasing the worker, and hit them with the back of a sword until they're in the ground screaming their pain. Sooner or later they understand their place, and that they need to work if they want to survive. They can't be parasites.
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@comradeconventrix my brother always used to say when teaching me English, "a metaphor is like a simile. Wait-"
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@comradeconventrix I know, I just could not hold that back :)
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@comradeconventrix It tickles my funnybone until I vomit laughter.
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@comradeconventrix Thing is, no matter how hard you press, you can't make everyone have the same performance. And that's why a hierarchy is needed.
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@comradeconventrix The reward must be in relation to the performance.
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@comradeconventrix And then it is unfair. Let's say, you have to build two walls, then you hire one guy for each wall. One ends in two days, the other one in four. Is it fair to pay the same to both? Shouldn't the one who finished the same work in less time have a bonus for his productivity?
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@comradeconventrix Why should he deserve the same if his performance was worse? This kind of mindset doesn't give any incentive to better oneself.
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@yodelerty Maybe he wants to be better because noone likes to fail?
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@hakupony The fact that he gave his best is not failing. He did his job, just worse than the other guy. So he should be paid less than the other guy.
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@comradeconventrix See? that's the problem. If building the wall is worth 1000, then the one who just finished it should be payed 1000, but the one who finished it in record time should be given a bonus, let's say, $1200, because his performance allowed the house to be buit faster and the owner to have a roof over his head sooner. As @yodelerty said, with no reward for performance, noone would care in honing their skills. If there's a reward, the guy who finished in four days would see how he could have gain by doing better, and he will learn how to do things faster, resulting in a better average performance of the collective of workers.
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@yodelerty Why? He did what you asked him for. Why would you care for his personal development? If he takes his job seriously, he will feel like he lost. If you do a race, you are not a winner if you reach the goal but if you are better then your competitors. So why do you want or need to penelize him for not being the best one?
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@comradeconventrix Umm, to improve himself so his best effort yields more fruit. If his boss promised him some sort of pay increase for finishing the wall in a specific amount of time, he would have some reason to try even harder to get the wall done as quickly as possible.
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@hakupony But he did it more slowly. Why hire someone who does a job slowly when you can hire someone who does it in half the time? Not only that, the guy who did it more quickly isn't going to feel very good knowing that someone who's taking twice as long to do the same job as him is getting paid the exact same. Sure, the slower guy feels good knowing that he got paid for his work, but the quicker guy doesn't feel like he accomplished much of anything and might just start slacking because he knows he'll just get paid the same anyway.
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@comradeconventrix Yup. It's ideological more than anything right now.
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@yodelerty You work under the assumption we are in the same economical system as we are today. There is a psyhological effect which we ignore: if you place an extrinsic motivation for something (like better payment for faster work), you kill the intrinsic motivation (like the pride to be awesome on what one does). Like I already said - many things just seem natural because we grew up with them.
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