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SO HOW ABOUT THOSE HORSES.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:16:34 UTC from web-
@ceruleanspark Taking mt lines...
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:17:24 UTC from web -
@ceruleanspark BEST OF ALL THE ANIMALS
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:17:38 UTC from web-
@rotation I LOVE HORSES, THEY'RE MY FRIENDS
Friday, 21-Dec-12 17:30:47 UTC from web-
@thelastgherkin Sadly http://deagostini.com.au/ilovehorses is no more. However, http://tinyurl.com/d4et8m9
Friday, 21-Dec-12 18:28:11 UTC from web-
@rotation YES YES YES
Friday, 21-Dec-12 18:29:50 UTC from web
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@ceruleanspark Related, yet unrelated, {ti xirma} is lojban for {This is a horse/equine/[colt/mare/stallion/pony]}
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:19:53 UTC from web-
@omni Was this langue created exclusively to make use of "Underused sounds/letters" or something
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:22:18 UTC from web-
@ceruleanspark Actually not. It was made for "unambigious communication which can easily be parsed by computers". I can give you another sentence, which will show that is probably isn't all that bad: {mi gleki lo su'u do tavla mi kei ku} which parses as {[1(2[gleki1 (happy thing(s)) :] mi I, me)2 [is, does] «3gleki being happy»3 (4[gleki2 (subject(s) of happiness) :] lo any/some <5su'u abstract nature of [6(7[tavla1 (talk-er(s)) :] do you)7 [is, does] «8tavla talk-ing»8 (9[tavla2 (talked to thing(s)) :] mi I, me)9]6 kei >5 ku )4]1} (I'm happy about the fact that you're talking to me).
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:26:06 UTC from web-
@omni Where is the need for such complexity.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:28:59 UTC from web-
@nerthos This apparent complexity is probably caused by the reduced dependency on context based semantics.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:30:11 UTC from web-
@kamikaze Yeah, probably. I'm still opposed to the widespread use of a language such as that one.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:31:37 UTC from web-
@nerthos English is very difficult for the reasons that make it so successful as a lingua franka. A beginner can already communicate a lot, with very simple, short sentences. However English is a very idiomatic language, it is influenced by hundreds of cultures, due to the history of the UK, its colonial history and the immigration rate of the US. Thus you can convey a superset of the concepts conveyable in many other languages. The downside is that everything you say is strongly context sensitive and requires a certain cultural background to be understood the way it was intended. TL;DR The semantics are a nightmare.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:39:24 UTC from web-
@kamikaze That's exactly what makes the languag nice.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:41:48 UTC from web-
@nerthos It makes it fun (as in poetic and playful) and easy to speak. It also makes it very difficult to understand.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:44:06 UTC from web-
@kamikaze Exactly. And in doing so, it forces you to learn more about it's intrincacies, different cultures, and a lot of other things. Once you learn enough, you're able to say lots of things in the same sentence, and at the same time deliberately hide meanings to the listener.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:46:06 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:47:37 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada That's because you aren't very bright.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:48:36 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:49:17 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Pretty much the opposite. It's fairly complex.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:49:47 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:51:47 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Teachers do that all of the time, out of ignorance, laziness, or both.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:53:03 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:54:41 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Japanese is an easy one. But the archaic ideogram-based witing ruins it.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:56:42 UTC from web-
@nerthos *writing
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:57:19 UTC from web -
@nerthos it is not as hard as it looks like, at leas the first dozens of kanji i know are not so complicated
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:58:03 UTC from web-
@mushi Ideograms are not hard, they are stupid. I don't even know why they use it, having hiragana and katakana, or even romanji.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:01:22 UTC from web-
@nerthos from what i know, it is was useful when then did not separate the words, but now it is silly indeed
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:02:12 UTC from web-
@mushi So, as I said, archaic.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:03:40 UTC from web
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Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:58:42 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Japanese is a semantic paradise.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:59:58 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:03:05 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada You think Spanish is hard to pronounce because you're used to a language with overly complicated pronunciation.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:04:37 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:06:26 UTC from web
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@anarchycarcino I don't doubt that.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:07:00 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:07:53 UTC from web
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Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:06:58 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada That's because you suck.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:07:27 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:09:18 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Let me present a compelling argument, good sir. http://ur1.ca/c5xtw
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:10:05 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:11:20 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Canada's yo daddy
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:13:08 UTC from web-
@nerthos We stay our distance from that stalker. It's why we don't legalize gay marriage, becuase he keeps pushing us about it.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:15:24 UTC from web-
@greenenchilada Memories of that night will haunt your manhood forever.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:16:10 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:18:17 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Your butt will never be the same.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:18:43 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:19:26 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada You were part of it anyway.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:20:07 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:20:58 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Geography doesn't lie.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:21:22 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:21:55 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada You are no true man.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:22:27 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:22:44 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada TRUTHS
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:23:05 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:25:53 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada HAHAHAHA, SUFFER
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:27:09 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:29:18 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada The fault was only yours.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:29:51 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:31:18 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada You still did it.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:31:50 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:33:41 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada And I have pics that prove you wrong.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:34:10 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:45:23 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Yo y u no clean da dishes now brah? Da kitchn iz drty!
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:08:24 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:08:40 UTC from web
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@nerthos they should creat new words, having the same word for clod and spider, for she and girlfrien, for bridge and eating sticks may get confusing
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:05:45 UTC from web-
ok, this linguístic stuff is cool, but imma empity my brain with videogames. byebey
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:11:51 UTC from web-
@mushi no, mushi, do not use ´
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:13:23 UTC from web
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@greenenchilada Japanese is silly and the pronuciations make sense, different from the other 2 languages i know
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:00:13 UTC from web
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@nerthos you don't have to convince me, I'm a huge fan of the language. There are a lot of things I can think and say in English that I wouldn't be able to in my native language. Yet no matter how proficient I am (and my English vocabulary is likely as huge as my German vocabulary), I never seem to run out of things I need to learn about it.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:49:50 UTC from web-
@kamikaze s/huge/vast/
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:51:11 UTC from web -
@kamikaze Yup. That's why I reject the idea of a logical language. It would just kill all the fun of speech. I can only think of it being succefully used in a professional enviorment.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:51:36 UTC from web
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@nerthos Lojban is a language which really focuses on structures and conversion. {su'u} shows the beginning of a "subsentence", which ends with {kei}. {lo} converts the selbri {tavla} to a sumti, and {ku} ends this conversion. The conversion is necessary because you can only have one selbri per sentence (similar to the English language, albeit I can't think of an example right now). It sounds complicated, but one you go through the tutorial a bit, it'll actually be quite logical: http://www.lojban.org/tiki/wavelessonscontinued
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:32:44 UTC from web-
@omni It's like coding your speech. And unnecesarily restrictive. Useless for anyone without an speech impediment.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:36:34 UTC from web-
@nerthos It's similar to coding your speech, yes, but this is important to prevent misunderstandings caused by being multiple ways to "decode" a sentence in most normal languages, and this also simplifies letting computers parse it. I know it seems restrictive, but I've learned enough to know there are generally a lot of different ways you can say the same thing, and there are special words which are broader, if you need to say "flying object" instead of a special kind of bird if something just flew by you, this is easily possible. I understand your concerns, though, but I haven't actually done enough lessons yet to be able to give a good reply as to why something is this way.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:40:40 UTC from web-
@omni It's made to completely avoid misunderstandings. As such, it's a boring language.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:42:34 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:46:45 UTC from web
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@omni It's made for people who have a hard time thinking like a human.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:47:36 UTC from web-
@nerthos It's not part of the mission statement, and enough humans make mistakes when trying to understand sentences of natural languages. Also, a lot of sentences are not logical at all ("I ain't afraid of no ghosts" should be a good example). The argument you put forward is a risky one, though, as it can only really be dismissed from either side with a personal attack.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:51:56 UTC from web-
@omni Would I be able to pull such a tricky argument in Lojban?
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:52:35 UTC from web-
@nerthos You can say "It's made for people who have a hard time thinking like a human." in lojban. The grammatical structure of that is far beyond what I've learned so far, though. I should've spend more than an hour or four on a language, but I think I got pretty far in a relatively short time (8 of the 28 lessons).
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:00:43 UTC from web-
@omni I remain unconvinced of the usefulness of such a language outside basic, direct exchangements of information.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:02:56 UTC from web-
@nerthos It has its pros and cons. It is harder to make word jokes in it, due to the lower ambiguity, so I can surely understand that would be an argument against it (though, in some times, that would surely be a pro).
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:04:08 UTC from web-
@omni Ambiguity is a key feature in areas such as law.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:05:21 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 22:05:51 UTC from web
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@ceruleanspark On a related note: lojban does not have all letters of the latin alphabet. It's missing the following letters h, q and w.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:29:20 UTC from web-
@omni Why. If I was gonna drop letters, I'd probably get rid of C, K, Q or X. Three of them make basically the same sound and X is just useless
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:31:32 UTC from web-
@ceruleanspark Lojban is a phonetic language, and those letters actually sound different from how they sound in the English language. "c" is pronounced as "sh" in "shop", "k" is pronounced as "c" in "cut" and "x" is pronounced as "ch" in "Bach". Q was a letter they found too ambiguous to choose a sound for, so that letter died off.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:35:42 UTC from web
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@redenchilada If you pronounce at least one of them wrong, yes.
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:41:18 UTC from web-
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:41:44 UTC from web
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@thatonestocking I don't know how similar they are grammatically (I believe not that much, because lojban is made to be more culture-neutral), but there are some similarities in their goals (or so I've been told).
Wednesday, 19-Dec-12 21:42:22 UTC from web
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