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if you try to justify piracy as anything besides literal theft IDK what to say to you
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 08:02:44 UTC from web-
@rarity If I had a nice book, it would be great for friends to make copies of it without damaging or destroying mine.
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Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 08:05:06 UTC from web
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@rarity But then I wouldn't be able to read it or keep it on my shelf! Cloning the book is much better. ;-)
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@rarity I am fine with piracy as long as you don't pirate from indie developers or the poorer side of the gaming industry.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 08:05:43 UTC from web-
@metaltao youre making the robin hood argument that its ok to steal from certain people and not from others, not based on any real ethics but rather just on their income. Arguably immoral to believe this.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:49:10 UTC from web-
@princelypublictimeline I don't do so, I can't stop them, I am not sure how to exactly feel so, I just put it on hold with this.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:50:33 UTC from web
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Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:06:57 UTC from web
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@caret7 because it's notabout whether the owner lost it, it's about whether someone who isnt supposed to have it illegally acquires it. There could be infinite apples but if theyre not for you but you take one then it's theft. Theft theft theft theft
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:07:33 UTC from web-
@princelypublictimeline I see. Taking that a step back: if something is not meant for me then is it bad for me take it?
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Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:22:06 UTC from web
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@rarity All right. Following that, how do we know who is supposed to have the item, or who can rightfully have a copy?
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@caret7 ...when you buy it? If someone says "I made this thing, and if you want me to give it to you, you need to give me money", if you get that thing without giving them money, it's theft. I don't get why this is a difficult concept
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:41:44 UTC from web-
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@caret7 Yes? If you pay for an item in the store, you are very unlikely to be accused of theft
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:02:05 UTC from web-
@rarity Okay. If I make a backup copy, is it thievery? Like, if I'm afraid that my CD might get scratches and stop working.
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@caret7 depends on he terms a d conditions of your purchase. For example most dvds are copy-protected and in buying it you agree that you will not try to circumvent that under penalty of law.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:18:02 UTC from web-
@princelypublictimeline And you're not allowed to watch them on oil rigs.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:18:57 UTC from web-
@thelastgherkin Especially of shore.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:19:21 UTC from web -
@thelastgherkin YOURE an oil rig
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:21:09 UTC from web -
@thelastgherkin I mean I usually watch them on DVD players.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:21:49 UTC from web -
@thelastgherkin I use an oil rig to mine for bitcoins
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 11:10:47 UTC from web
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@princelypublictimeline Thievery is defined by the people who made the item? How can we say whether their choice is moral or immoral?
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@caret7 thievery is defined by law. Owners of property determine what they sell and the terms and conditions. The buyer and/or nonowner is actually the one whose agreement or disagreement determines theparameters of potential theft or lawful ownership
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 14:17:30 UTC from web-
@princelypublictimeline your name's not long enough.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 14:48:01 UTC from web
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Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:02:49 UTC from web
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@caret7 buying something is comparable to a verbal contract, legalizing the exchange of giids or services with $
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 10:13:42 UTC from web
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@caret7 You're saying you're rightfully entitled to steal things.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:42:19 UTC from web -
@caret7 law. We already have laws. Theyre a thing. If you file for a copyright or patent, thats what determines it. The owner can choose to share or sell his property whether it be physical or otherwise. Someone acquiring said stuff without owner's permiwsionxis therefore breaking law.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:42:47 UTC from web -
@caret7 there's also property that's either physical or intellectual. There's a lot of law that protects people's property so that they can safely use it for whatever purpose
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:44:29 UTC from web -
@caret7 and if buy something you can use what you purchase as long as you obey the law and agree to any terms and conditions set by the seller.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:45:52 UTC from web
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@caret7 yes. The alternative would be people agreeing that theft is a moral action, aka I dont wanna hear any whining when people legally empty a thief's house of all his/her property. Lets take it a step back further: can you logically support theft as a moral action?
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:36:10 UTC from web-
@princelypublictimeline I can't.
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@caret7 then there ya go
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:47:34 UTC from web
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Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 17:32:42 UTC from web-
@loveydoe sounds like it was made by someone that doesnt understand law. Copying is theft. If you dont wanna buy a dvd for whatever self-entitled reason, and you choose to pirate it, you just stole the $ value. That value is what the seller or ower could have obtained if you did not steal it. Digital piracy affect's the IP's owner's ability to make money. And that video's creator thinks it's only theft if something physical is missing afterward which is also untrue. and they dont really back the claim to begin with, they just assume it's true and roll with it
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 05:35:18 UTC from web-
@princelypublictimeline This animator is one of the most successful Creative Commons animators around. While you argue that copying is theft because of law, me, caret7, and Nina Paley are arguing that it is not theft, in the traditional sense, because the goods are still able to be sold. You are absolutely right that, by law, illegal copying is theft. One is not prevented from supporting their favorite authors or programmers with pay after they have downloaded an illegal copy, though. It would be a shame to pay for or support something that wasn't worthwhile. I don't think we can change each other's minds.
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@loveydoe The "it would be a shame to support something that wasn't worth it" argument is literally invalid considering you can always ask other people what they thought, though
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:12:40 UTC from web-
@redenchilada It is just my opinion, and it isn't invalid to me. :-)
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@loveydoe I'm just saying it's a dolety attempt to justify the "piracy is not stealing" argument. I pirate stuff sometimes but I don't go around pretending it's an okay thing to do.
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:18:27 UTC from web-
@redenchilada I see.
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Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:16:26 UTC from web
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@zeldatra I didn't intend to get that idea across. I meant to say that she does care at least a bit about copyright law, because she licenses her works under the Creative Commons licenses, and advocates using them.
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@loveydoe Advocating the use of free/libre licenses is not the same as advocating the violation of paid/proprietary licenses.
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@scribus @redenchilada @zeldatra Guys, I appreciate your thoughts on this, but there doesn't need to be a clash of political views every day. This was once a fun site for me.
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@loveydoe I know /that/ feeling for sure. So. How about those horses
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:27:07 UTC from web-
@cinnamonswirl sunbutt tho
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:27:25 UTC from web -
@cinnamonswirl I love those horses. <3
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@loveydoe Me too. Me too. Who is your favourite?
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:28:45 UTC from web-
@cinnamonswirl I couldn't pick one. Rarity is one of the prettiest for me.
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@loveydoe She's definitely the prettiest of the mane 6. AJ has the sweetest personality though. My favourite overall is Trixie though.
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:31:43 UTC from web
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@cinnamonswirl So very horsey. :)
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@scribus *whinnies seductively*
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:31:57 UTC from web-
@cinnamonswirl The sound of angels is a whinny and the swish of fluttering eyes.
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@loveydoe A swishing tail. A gentle hoofbeat. A muffled whinny. Welcome, to Night Vale.
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 17:34:19 UTC from web-
@cinnamanswirl A saddle made of interwoven capitalist and communist symbols, embroidered with olive branches for strength, and decorated with dove feathers. Word from Albert --- you know, the farmer --- is that she has come to lead us to the Worthy Beyond, which, as a bystander has said, the horse refuses to describe.
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@loveydoe i just grow weary of people who think they shouldnt have to pay for stuff. So they try to redefine words in order to support their argument. Taling something that doesnt belong to you is theft, even if there are infinite of the item in question: the ol victimless crime argument's been disprpven several times. You cant change meanings of words just to win legal or legislative battles. Not understandimg the damage piracy causes is not an excuse to call it victimless. If you have a job, your boss should make you work without pay. Youre technically not losing amy physical items, but you'll sure feel like youre losing out. If you can agree that time and money are thinfs that can be lost, maybe then you'll understand why it is a conceoted notion to justify unlawful copying. Stealing on the promise of supporting the victim later is also silly: "hey i'll rob that bamk, but im a customer so it's okay"
Thursday, 31-Jul-14 22:13:07 UTC from web
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@caret7 You are paying for the utility of having a copy, not the copy itself. If you use the product without paying, you have stolen that utility.
Wednesday, 30-Jul-14 09:12:53 UTC from web
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@nut Would you look at that. I have to manually type all of those @ tags in my replies. :-)
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